Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Jul 24, 2012 21:01:08 GMT 1
I've caught a queen yesterday which might be a Formica sanguinea ( ID thread on Yuku). I've done some reading on F. sanguinea on the internet and found that in nature, a newly mated queen infiltrates a nest (mostly those of F. fusca) and kills the queen to take over the nest. If you want to keep them in captivity you have to at least give the queen some pupae out of another nest (preferably F. fusca). Once she has some slave workers she will start laying eggs. The F. sanguinea workers that will emerge from those eggs will eventually replace the slave workers, which slowly die out (if you don't supply new ones that is, in nature F. sanguinea raids other nests to get fresh slave workers). To cut it short: - Does anyone have experience with keeping F. sanguinea? - Is the above (not the previous point, but the part above that ) true and specifically is it true the queen only needs slave workers when starting out and doesn't require them anymore later on?
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Jul 25, 2012 2:40:20 GMT 1
Yes, it's true that F. sanguinea can only start a colony with the aid of workers, but the way she does it is not quite like other social parasites. Formica sanguinea does sometimes adopt mature workers, but she'll usually just scare away or kill the whole colony, then raise the brood as her own. I have a journal for Formica aserva on the yuku forum, which is essentially the North American version of Formica sanguinea. Unlike obligate slave raiders, such as Polyergus or some other sanguinea-group Formica, the workers of this species will take on the responsibilities of the nest later in life.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Jul 25, 2012 17:36:05 GMT 1
Thanks batspiderfish, nice to see you here as well. Really informative and detailed journal you have there. Will be following it and try to imitate what you're doing if it's successful. Your first queen (the one you gave three Formica glacialis pupae) seems to be doing well so far (haven't read the whole journal yet, just the first part for now). I also found this post by you. Very informative as well, cleared up a lot of things to me on parasitic ants. I've been searching for Formica Fusca around here and found workers of (presumably) F. fusca in two places but I was unable to trace the nest and snatch some pupae. Do they need slaves/brood from another Formica specie or would a Lasius specie (say niger) also suffice? I doubt it but I'm crossing my fingers since they're all over the place and very easy to get .
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Jul 25, 2012 18:30:46 GMT 1
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Jul 27, 2012 7:42:32 GMT 1
If your keeping a slave maker queen, your gunna need a formica rufa nest you can get brood from quite alot. formica fusca should be fine, but they normally raid formica rufa from what i've heard
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Jul 27, 2012 11:20:21 GMT 1
They normally raid Formica fusca and similar species. Formica rufa are usually only tackled by very large colonies of F. sanguinea, since these have a similar body type and are slightly more dangerous than F. fusca. Formica sanguinea is a temporary social parasite, and only needs brood for their founding stages; afterwards, they will grow like any other colony of ants.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Jul 28, 2012 17:22:56 GMT 1
There are more F. fusca nests around here than I thought. Found workers in plenty different locations but I'm having a hard time locating their nests. Most of the workers I found are in fields or roadsides with high grass. Lasius niger often likes to make large "skycrapers" made of sand alongside blades of grass (grasscrapers?), does F. fusca do this? The only F. fusca nest I found so far is beneath a brick parking lot. I considered prying loose one brick when there's no one around, but then again... I don't want to wreck the parking lot or get into trouble... Haven't found any life F. rufa nests, the one of which I knew the location seems to have died, there's just an empty flattened pile of pine needles left. I guess I could search for F. rufa instead of F. fusca since their nests are much easier to spot (although riskier to take pupae from I suppose) One or another, I should hurry finding some slave pupae because the queen is showing signs of weakness: mainly sluggishness and instability. I'm feeding her honey water but I'm not sure if she's drinking it, she isn't showing any signs of improvement at least. I also gave her one L. niger pupa I collected to boost my L. niger queens, to see how she would react to it, perhaps use it as food. So far she hasn't shown any interest in it. I'll keep you updated and hope she'll make it. *goes back to pupae hunting*
|
|
|
Post by Myrm on Jul 28, 2012 17:27:42 GMT 1
Keeping my fingers crossed that she will make it.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Jul 28, 2012 17:32:48 GMT 1
I too hope she pulls through.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Jul 28, 2012 20:58:12 GMT 1
Doesn't sound too good. try a cricket head. or an insect. and put 30 or more pupae (and make sure they're not all male eggs!)
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Jul 30, 2012 15:48:55 GMT 1
Good news! She seems more alert and active since yesterday and no longer has problems keeping her balance, I guess she fed some on the honey water after all. Also, perhaps just as important: I finally managed to collect some Formica fusca pupae today! I went back to that one parking lot where I found a F. fusca nest, with the intention to pry loose a brick. When I put the shovel in one of the seams to leverage the brick out, ants came crawling out, F. fusca ants. I Grabbed a twig nearby and starting removing the sand from the seam and found some pupae! I managed to collect about 15 of them without having to pry out a brick or do massive damage to the nest. So glad. ;D Back home I selected 8 good looking pupae and discarded the ones I beheaded with the first shovel hit . Poured the pupae into the tube of my F. sanguinea queen. At first she was startled by the pupae bumping into her ass abdomen. but before even panicking she started examining the pupae, showing great interest in them for two seconds. She then ran towards the exit of the tube, inspected the cotton wool plug a bit, ran back to the pupae again and began collecting them in one neat pile, which she still sits on top of at the time of writing, occasionally grooming and moving some. I guess I will turn this topic into a journal and keep you guys updated on any progress related to cute little "enter queen's name here" (suggestions are welcome).
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Jul 30, 2012 16:13:27 GMT 1
Formica fusca pupae today! :/ i thought fusca has cocoons the ones i know of do But i may have misidentified them
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Jul 30, 2012 16:35:12 GMT 1
:/ i thought fusca has cocoons the ones i know of do But i may have misidentified them Cocoons are pupae, only wrapped in a silken lining; what's underneath the cocoon is essentially the same as the pupae of the ants who don't use them.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Jul 30, 2012 17:49:09 GMT 1
Yes but i thought formica fusca produced cocoons not pupae?? especially in the wild with a substrate
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Jul 30, 2012 18:23:09 GMT 1
Oh! Sometimes the workers don't bury them, and they pupate in the way that, say, Myrmica would (naked pupae).
|
|